Florenz Ziegfeld on Afterlife Sex, Birth of Astral Children and Advanced Spiritual Evolution

This amazing seance starts off with the voice of Leslie Flint's control, Mickey (conversing with sitters), and then another speaker (Madam Blavatsky) very briefly telling one of the sitters not to lean forward, before "Flo" Ziegfeld comes through. Eventually, after a long and fascinating discussion, Ziegfeld's voice is replaced mid-sentence by another personality, David a former Scotsman nicknamed "Jock" followed by Frederic Chopin who finally chimes in at the end of recording, before Mickey returns to finish up the entire seance.

Florenz Ziegfeld, Jr., (March 21, 1867 - July 22, 1932) popularly known as "Flo" Ziegfeld, was an American Broadway impresario, notable for his series of theatrical revues, the Ziegfeld Follies, inspired by the Folies Berg�re of Paris. He also produced the musical Show Boat. He was known as the "glorifier of the American girl". Flo Ziegfeld is a member of the American Theater Hall of Fame. More on Ziegfeld can be found here Please GO HERE if videos don't load

This seance starts out with lots of laughter and a few light-hearted exchanges between Leslie Flint's control, Mickey, Leslie Flint, and the sitters Rosie Creet and Mr. Rollingston.

Spirit guide Madam Blavatsky: "Don't lean forward, Mr. Rollingston, relax!"

Sitter Mr. Rollingston: "I am . . ."

Spirit guide Madam Blavatsky: "Thank you."

Sitter Rosie Creet: [Laughter]

Leslie Flint: "Were you leaning forward, Les?"

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Hallo . . ."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Hello?"

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: ". . . can you hear?"

Rose Crete: "Yes, Flo! Yea, very good."

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Very good. I just pop in for a few minutes for a little more experience with speaking to you. Can you hear what I am . . ."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yea, you . . . [unintelligible] Flo. You came through."

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "I want to make my . . . [unintelligible] your side if I happen to..."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "[laughter]"

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Perseverance is one of the most important things if you are going to do anything at all in any way."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "That's quite right, that's what you have on Earth."

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "If you want to communicate you have to stick it out and keep on pushing away, pushing away. If you could see all these people around here, I guess you would have plenty to talk about."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Hmmm. Tell us . . . if you come through, while you are here you might as well tell us, uhhh, something of your band and so on."

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Well, I don't think I'd be far wrong if I took someone, at least one person of every nation or nationality and every generation of time under the sun here. You know, the more one sees his life, the more one realizes how much we have to learn. Even on this side, I realize there are souls who have been here centuries and centuries and centuries who progressed beyond any outward appearance of the physical body, yet they still retain, you might say . . . errr, personality, for it's the personality that you feel and you sense, and in a sense you see, but you don't see that personality, you don't see that individual, if you like, in a physical outline or shape, but it is something that you are conscious of, and they are very highly evolved souls who have left behind completely and absolutely every condition of Earth every vestige of the material life. They are completely solely and wholly Spirit, and in consequence, their physical and outer organ . . . organism is completely gone."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "You mean to say you just don't sense them, you can't hear anything?"

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Well that may be, because I can't reach up to them and they can't manifest on my particular plane of my existence. No doubt in time, eventually I rise sufficiently high they will become visible to me as human beings, that is shall we say as souls of spirits as of people. Whether they would be exactly the same shape, I doubt it, I don't know, but there is one thing I think that becomes very obvious to hear, when you've been here any time at all, or should I say more exactly having made any kind of progress, you gradually lose that all the material, physical aspects that differentiates male from female gradually disappears, and you have in it's stead a sexless individual, a sexless spirit with no real physical difference. I don't know if I am making this clear at all."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yes Flo, I think . . ."

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "I think when you get down to basic things, you realize that the outward physical shape of the human body is merely a matter of, well you might almost say, chance. Whether it's actually chance or not, I don't know, but whether you happen to be one sex or the other is in a sense, unimportant. It just happens as you grow up, you are either female or male or a mixture of the two.

Very well, over here, you begin to realize that there is a fusing as it were, much more than ever on Earth of male and female. There is a sort of rejuvenation, I don't even know if that is even the word to use, but that there is an awareness and an awakening to the cosmic realities and the consciousness of life, spiritual, which gradually takes away all the old earthly ideas regarding male or female and many of the things appertaining to sex on your side. That doesn't necessarily happen at once, I'm quite sure it doesn't, certainly in my case and in many of my friends here I know that retain outwardly, identically the same appearance they had on Earth or possibly a little or quite a bit younger. But I do know from some of those I've linked up or communed with that there is to all outward appearances no sex. I don't know if I am going to describe this at all well, but the point is that . . . you lose . . ."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "You would lose something of the emotions I suppose?"

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Yea, well everything becomes on a very, very highly, refined status or stage or state of evolution where love is the dominating factor, but it is a love that is completely and absolutely spiritual where the old desires and the old physical conditions are lost. Thus this may not happen to some for many, many centuries of time or you term it."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Then the organs of the body too recede, the organs in our body for instance, all that must gradually disappear?"

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Yea, yea, but you see, I think someone may have told you, I don't know, about this idea before, gradually all the internal organs disappear. For instance, when you first come here, you have the desire to eat and drink and you have those things, but gradually the desire leaves you to eat, the desire leaves you to drink, so you find over the process of time without any sort of, perhaps, inner consciousness at first, inner, certain organs gradually begin to disappear, and you find eventually as you lose the desire to eat and drink, you sort of don't have the same sort of mental approach to things, so certain parts, as it were, the body disappear. They no longer have any value or any use. So the same applies with physical organs, sex organs, for instance."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yes, but at certain times there must be form, mustn't there?"

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Oh yea, yea, I know that. I know, but what I am trying to tell you is that, that as a gradual process of change in the mentality, the gradual change in the personality, gradual change in the character of the person, as the spiritual body begins to be affected by the mental and the emotional, the inner self, the soul, if you like, so you get these changes gradually taking place, and you get to such a state that you cease to exist in a certain sphere or spheres, and you go into a much higher stage of being, much higher state of life where things are quite different, where you lose the outer shape as you understand it."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Do you have to go through a certain form of death, shall we say, like we have to go through here?"

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Yea, yea, in a way you do, but it's not the same kind of death. I don't know how to describe it to you."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "No, I . . ."

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Look, you can talk about a chrysalis and a butterfly; you've got some vague idea of what I mean. As you progress and progress, you gradually find the body you've been using is no longer of any need or value to you, and you discard it. You go into a kind of mental coma, if you like, and you find when you come out of that state of coma, that you are without the body, which was a replica only of the physical body anyway in the first place, and you find that you have a much more purified and rarified form, though not in the form as you've known when on Earth. You see, the etheric body is an exact counterpart of the physical body, but that is not the real you any more than your body today is the real you. It's only the covering, it's only the vehicle of the soul."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yes."

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "And it is the soul that goes on and on, not the etheric body. That may last perhaps for centuries of time as you understand time, maybe thousands of years, because there are many phases of life, many spheres of activity. You retain your outward shape and form, perhaps for centuries. I know that in my case, I am sure a long way from getting to become a complete soul. I'm just at the moment, an individual who has progressed to a certain degree, but I know that I still retain all my outward appearance and shape as I was known on Earth and I guess that goes on for a really long time, because I know I've gotta lot to learn! [Editor's note: At the time of this recording, Flo had only been "dead" for nearly 22 years.]

Because I do know eventually, same as these people we don't see, but we know we sense, if you like. I don't know how to put it, but we have mediums here, in a sense, like you have mediums in your world who are highly rarified beings who are in a position, though not to go over there themselves, that is to the very high stages of being, but are able to receive a certain amount of information and help, which they pass on to us who are less fortunate and not so highly developed.

Every phase, every stage of humanity has to be reached past and progressed to a new realm or higher. Every individual passes through stages; you're passing through a stage now, and when you come here you'll pass through a process of change. You'll go on and you'll live very much a similar sort of life in some ways, that is you'll have the same mental reactions; known that for quite a while, regarding love and affection. You'll have the same, perhaps, even passions. Physical love exists on this side. It's not something discarded immediately. It's not something that's looked down upon. It's something that's quite natural. You still have the same mental attitude to certain things, and while those things are important, while those things are vital, you still have that ability to carry on in the same way. There is no disgrace in that. No one can suddenly become a complete, perfected soul. You have to go through all these different conditions and stages.

Children are born over here too on certain spheres, and those children are very beautiful because they're born of the mind and of the soul and of the spirit. They're born as it were of love, and although the physical, shall we, if I can use such a word, the psychic bodies are used to procreate the child in union, and yet there isn't the contamination, as it were of the real material essence or part. You know there are so many things we've got to explain, but the point is, it's very difficult.

If you could really divide, I suppose, every plane into many sections, that might help, but it's very difficult what one person may tell you, like our friend who just spoke about the house on the mist, and that was his experience, but that was because he'd only reached a certain development--certain stage--in fact you might almost saw the same in his initial case, he hadn't reached very far at all, but he had to bridge the gulf for himself; it was something he had to do. But his reception, once he desired help and guidance and upliftment made it easier for his friends to help him. Gradually he was led on. But there are some people when they first come here because they lived exemplary lives on your side; they make a much greater progress, and their reception is quite different and their experience is different.

But that as I say, everyone that comes can only tell his own story in his own way, and although there may be differences in a way, gradually you find that it all dovetails in, it all tallies like a jigsaw puzzle; every bit is important to the whole."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yes that should make all the stories very, very interesting, all the variable ones."

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Yea they will be always interesting, I know that, but you have to be very patient, you know. Because it is not easy coming to talk to you people. It is not easy for us to form words to depict things we want to give you, you know. Whatever we tell you, I want you to realize it can only be just a glimpse of what we try to convey. We got to bring it down to material language and much must be lost. We do our best, you know."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Those glimpses would help us all a great deal."

Communicator Florenz Ziegfeld: "Well I want you to know above anything else is, that whatever your life has been on Earth, whether it has been very good, very bad, or not so bad like most people, there is a chance, there is a home, there is a hope, and above all there is a love that will sustain you, that will help you, that will guide you, that will uplift you and save you. There're so many friends here of all degrees, all conditions, stages of development, and always ready to give a helping hand to the newcomers. No one need fear dying no matter what his condition is, for in the end, eventually, there's a path. No matter if it's some poor soul did some pretty grim things, may be there were some redeeming features in himself, may be there was something way back in his history, in his parent's history maybe that sowed a seed that, well, made him do certain things that were pretty wrong--probably very wrong.

There's aways a love, there's always a power, there's always a way from every one of God's children. No one is denied to ask for help, for once there is a redeeming desire, you might say within one's self, then you are on the right road. It may not be an easy road, may be a difficult road for some, but you are never alone, the same as a friend that was mentioned to you who was lost in the mists. That condition of mist was created by the thoughts, the evil thoughts, the bad thoughts of untold numbers of souls who created it in from your world. Wherever around your world there is a land of mist. It hovers over your Earth like a black pool. Some people, when they leave your world, pass right through it without even knowing it it's there because their minds and their lives have been elevated to such an extent they couldn't be conscious of its existence.

There are many to whom that fog is a reality and they moor a hold, they hover in it for quite a while. For sometimes, still coming up to us, they find it easier to get down to you. And they hover around your world rather than merge into this condition of depression and fog around you and the Earth, and they impinge themselves on the minds and mentalities of weak people. That is why you have to be strong in your world. You have to learn to overcome your self. You have to learn to overcome the things in your self that you know are bad, that are wrong. That's why it's important that you should have courage, faith, and you should have within your self enough love for all humanity, and while unholy the individual is, you should have some sympathy, try to have some understanding, for as you give out kind thoughts, as you give out love as you give out sympathy, soul you're helping not only the individuals concerned, but your self, and also those who are earthbound around your world, and believe me there are many.

If only you could see them, and if you can see the kind of places they haunt, you wouldn't go near any one of them. You take the man who is a drunkard; he haunts sometimes the places which were a fixture to him when on Earth. He sees his own cronies and his companions standing on the bar having another one, and often he gets a great satisfaction and enjoyment out of that. And you find that the vices and the lower part of himself enters as it were, into the physical organism of the friend or person, whoever it may be in the Earth condition, and you get influences set to work. You know, you look in your papers, and you read, don't you? Someone been attacked, perhaps some young girl's been attacked, and the next night you read about another one. Perhaps the next night you read about three or four more. Well, that's the kind of condition that arises because it affects the minds of others. It impinges itself upon the weak mentality, and perhaps someone here who in a moment of foolishness, a man's committed a murder. He may hover around and impinge his thoughts on someone else with weak mentality and a like nature, and someone else does the same deed.

You'll always find in your world, that one deed sets off a dozen others or more. Same as a war: it grows in its intensity and ferocity. Once you set, as it were, the ball rolling, it gathers speed and it gathers to it, tremendous force and power. The higher the rate is, the greater the force behind it. You just don't know in your world what the power of thought is like. So it's important that when you think, you think right thoughts, so you live right lives, and you do right things, and I know if you strive always to do your best, you can't go far wrong because there's plenty of good friends here, who come to you to guide you, to help you, to uplift you [note change in accent from American to Scottish in the middle of this sentence!] to share all your little problems and your troubles, and guide you if they can. Life's to be lived, at the same time, there is a way of living it!

Scottish Communicator Jock (David): "Can you hear what I say?

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Oh, there is somebody else now."

Sitter Mr. Rollingston: "Yes, it's a Scotch man."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Oh, Scotch. Is it?"

Sitter Mr. Rollingston: "Yes, its voice suddenly changed."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yes, I'm . . ."

Scottish Communicator Jock: "Hi, it's alright, I'm taking over now. My other friend got tired so I thought I take over for you, 'cause we are both on the same thought vibration, and I can quite easily pass over his thoughts."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Oh, that's interesting!"

Sitter Mr. Rollingston: "That's a very sleek changes."

Scottish Communicator Jock: "Hallo, can you hear now what I am talking about?"

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yes."

Scottish Communicator Jock: "That's good."

Sitter Mr. Rollingston: "You've been before, haven't you?"

Scottish Communicator Jock: "Aye, many a time in the past. I've been right close to the instrument many years now."

Sitter Mr. Rollingston: "You have, you certainly . . ."

Scottish Communicator Jock: "Aye, I remember you now my laddie."

Sitter Mr. Rollingston: "That's right . . ."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Jock, oh do explain to me how that happened? Does he get tired or something?"

Scottish Communicator Jock: "No, but you have to remember is we're all working together here and working on a mental plane, and there is mind over time. Whereas it's difficult for you to realize that in your world, it's more in your world, physical, obviously. Here, it's mental.

Sitter Mr. Rollingston: "Could you explain . . ."

We can transmit, as it were, all our thoughts through, and yet we can all have a go, and yet one can take over automatically from the other, all linking up together."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Oh, this is the first time that it happened . . ."

Scottish Communicator Jock: "Quite intriguing, aye there are some things you know nothing yet! Aye, got plenty of things up my sleeve for you! Aye, all sorts of experiments too! I think this Friday night is gonna be one of the real . . . well, I think it's gonna be something even more than you can realize, but it's going to take time. Once we get on the right mental plane working with you in complete harmony and I know we can do some wonderful things."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Ooo! I'm sure you can. We are all absolutely thrilled."

Scottish Communicator Jock: "You know, one of the greatest things is the realization that we are exactly what we ourselves have made ourselves, and once we accept the fact that we are what we have created, that lots of limits is done for us, but what we have made ourselves, it gives us great opportunity to make so much more of our selves. Often you hear people in your world say, 'I don't know. . . I don't know why some are able to this, and some are able to do that. I don't have a chance.' and yet they seem to get on much better than I do. I know that sometimes things in your world seem very unequal, but there's a reason behind everything.

What you have to remember is, and although you are an individual, or shall we say you're forming yourself into an individual. To a great extent, you are reacting along a natural line peculiar to your self and no one can affect you. Though you may have be born, shall we say, into better circumstances, there's no doubt about it, you just still follow that same sort of road. You may not've done quite the same things, you may have not had the same social standard as it were, but fundamentally, you'd still have had the same intuitions, you'd still have the same sort of emotional reactions to people and circumstances. You'd still be much the same personality, although your outward appearances would have been different come circumstances. The whole point is that you are what you are, what you are forming yourself. You are become what you are by your previous thoughts and actions.

You have no doubt in your own mind as you have no doubt in your own mind that you are separate individual, but that does not mean to say that you can afford to neglect or ignore the other individual or individuals around and about you. It does not also affect the fact that you are to a certain extent today what circumstances made your parents. You know there is an old saying that the sins of the parents follow the children, and that's not altogether correct, but there is a certain truth in it then.

Thus life is all fluidic. Life is not something that begins at birth and ends at death. Life goes on; life in its essence. I want you to remember I use the word, "essence." Life in its essence is a fluidic force or power which flows and flows continually through time and space having no beginning and no ending. But it may flow, as it must eventually, into a physical organism or body. That body becomes a house or a case, but that small part of the individual becomes the individual spirit gradually begins to express itself, gradually begins to merge as a personality, but it is still in its essence part of the whole. Anyway, I don't know if you can follow what I am trying to get at?"

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yes."

Sitter Mr. Rollingston: "Yes, definitely."

Scottish Communicator Jock: "You have to become a personality. You have to become a character before you can evolve separately from the essence."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yes."

Sitter Mr. Rollingston: "Yes."

Scottish Communicator Jock: "Though the essence is there. It's like the small spark that's gradually flared into a tremendous flame. "

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yes."

Scottish Communicator Jock: "The physical house is merely the outer shell for a space of time in which it is able to live and express itself, that you may have many houses, not necessarily always on Earth, but many houses on this side, many etheric houses, many psychic houses, if you like to call them such. You go through spheres and spheres, plane and plane until you become part once again of the whole, but in such a force and such a way, that you are a tremendous vital essence, whereas previously in the very early stages you were merely just a speck in everything. The same as you must feel at times you were a speck in time in the material sense. So, in the early stages you are but a speck in spiritual matter or spiritual time. You are merely as it were just the smallest grain of spiritual force or soul power. But eventually as you evolve and evolve and evolve, you become, you expand, and you become a unit, you become an integral and important part of the whole. But to reach that stage of being and existence, to reach that magnificence, you have to reach all sorts of conditions and phases of life. You see?"

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Yes."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Now who is that now? Is that you still, Jock?"

Frederic Chopin: "I come, pleased to, to speak to you. Oh, it is a little difficult for me perhaps at the moment . . ."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Chopin!"

Frederic Chopin: ". . . that I express everything so clearly as my friends. I just want you know I was here too, and, well, I can tell you in my own way later, things which were 'music' on me . . ."

Sitter Rosie Creet: "Oh, yes."

Frederic Chopin: ". . . because music is the basis, in a sense of life. For vibration is life, vibration is music. Harmony: it is the very essence . . ."

(At this point, tape ends abruptly.)